::lightbulb:: anime vids v. live action vids (internal motion and accessible vidding)

[permetaform]

This is a theory, and I might just be talking out of my ass, but I think I *might* know why anime vids tend towards the seizure inducing.

Part of the problem is that the *average* anime watcher appears to listen to music that moves along at a fair clip. To find an anime vid that uses slow music is *extremely* rare.

But part of the problem is inherent within the source itself.

Namely, regarding anime source, it's far more difficult to create internal motion in anime than in live action. For live action source, it's the opposite (it's far more difficult to create external motion).

<sub>[internal motion: motion that occurs within the scene. ex. shooting gun, falling body, kicking]

[external motion: camera movement. ex. zoom, pan, rotate]</sub>

But see, that's not a problem with live action vidding; the vidder can create external motion by manipulating the source clips. (want more info? I've written how-to's here and here)

But, for the opposite problem in anime source, how do you create internal motion? You can fiddle around with masks (but that uses already present source) or you photoshop frame by frame (which is utterly insane).

To keep up with the speed and movement of a song, an anime vidder is therefore forced to fall back on creating more external motion themselves, ie. tons of effects and fast clipping.

And honestly, part of issue is also with how much closer the average anime vidder works with the music. The rhythm, timing, and the way they correlate to the visuals are vital in a community that doesn't give similar weight to storytelling. It is vital in a community where near *everyone* is pan-fandom and yet highly likely to have never seen the anime you're vidding. (As for live action vidding, aLOT more weight is given to the story, and in general vidders are vidding for people very familiar with the source.)

Incidentally, I think that making a vid strong in rhythm and timing, and making it visually interesting (through effects and through penetrable clip choice) is one of the surest ways to make your vid accessible to people unfamiliar with the fandom.

ie. fill it with The Shiny!

_{['penetrable clip choice': made up description to refer to clips easily understandable by new viewers.
Example: the shot on "one hand clapping" for Jig of Life by shallot. It makes sense visually, relating the sound of a gun clap to the idea of a hand clap, even though I don't know the context of the scene]}

[]

Happy Birthday siobhan_w, pandarus, potterwitch, isagel, and rozfics! May your years be filled with color and song! =)

Comments

[absolutedestiny.livejournal.com]

If you are looking for good amvs with less beat-matched high-action flashiness then you might be interested in some of the following:

Video Girl Ai: The Fall by Lostboy
Storytelling by um... me (and to a lesser extent Memories of Love and Conflict too.
Playground Love by Nightowl Pictures
Blackbird by Zabet
Transcending Love by Vlad Pohnert (masks 3 different shows to make its own narrative)

And of course a shitload of old school videos that I can't think of right now - especially 2-vcr videos. I'm sure there's many many more.

I do agree that the footage does define a very different sort of editing. If I had some server space I'd upload my few live action videos for comparison with the amvs I do. Maybe I'll get to Vividcon next year - I only just heard about it but was happy to see my IWIWAL video was well received.

[permetaform]

You made the IWIWAL? =D Great vid! deft use of masks and great use of comedic shots!

As for high-action flashyness I'm fine with it as long as it has a purpose, and I *adore* vids that molest the beat, which is part of the reason why I love Mitternacht by Pwolf so much. It has a simple story (that follows more of an emotional/tension-based story arc than a conventional narrative) but it makes simply fantastic use of the beat, creating tension and then exploiting it. Euphoria by Koop is also a great one, and even though it was high in effects it still told a coherent story, guy!intro -> girl1!intro -> conflict -> girl2!intro -> big!conflict -> conclusion.

But yes! more recs! ::happy dance:: I'll download it once I get to my own computer. =)

Heh, this is so strange, where was this post linked from? I'm getting all these new people peeking in that I don't know, not that I mind. It's always good to find more vidders that's willing to discuss.

ooo, speaking of discussion, I've collected various vid meta here. Please please tell me if you know of any meta that doesn't appear there, it's a constantly updating work-in-progress. Most of the discussion linked to already are by live action vidders and it'll be great to have different perspectives there too.

[absolutedestiny.livejournal.com]

Well I must say it's like walking over a hill and discovering a whole other world on the other side.

I knew vidding was in all areas of fandom (mostly through fellow amv-ers who have been makng sci-fi videos since the 70s or something) but I didn't know there was so much coordinated and written about.

The differences are facinating, not only the differences between the techniques in the two forms but also the fandom and appreciation. I'd post all my thoughts but at this point I'm not sure I can totaly clarify them :)


I found this thread via friend gravenimaj who makes wonderful thought provoking videos which I foolishly failed to recommend earlier. I've seen much discussion of vividcon of late and read a whole bunch of con reviews (where I found my video mentioned). It's all very interesting to me as I do dabble in live action stuff as well (although animated works are more suited to my editing tastes, but that's for a later discussion :P).

I think one thing I've witnessed (which there is a painful lack of in the amv community) is actual detailed analysis of structural elements. Video criticism in the amv community has really become simply 1) "Did I like it" and 2) Was it techincally executed well. While both valid points to make it has changed the focus of amv making a great deal since the digital revolution to the point where basics such as narrative are lost due to anal micromanagement. It's rare to have a balance of the two and nobody EVER talks about narrative. Actual discussion of the creation process has really just become talk of technical with the really talented ones not really divulging their methodologies and hence limiting discourse. It's a shame really, so it's very refreshing to see it frequently discussed here.

I think it's likely that I'll be popping in from time to time and dabbling a little more in other vid fandoms. Things are always a little busy for me as I'm currently running animemusicvideos.org but I'm always happy to talk about video editing.

Some meta you might be interested in are the interviews with a few creators that are hosted on the org - they give an insight into their creative processes and... other things :)

There's other stuff too I'm sure but I'll return when I've had more of a think. There's lots more recs I could make... LOTS. I think of the amv.org top lists the Top Favourite list has a very good selection. The top 10% list is good too but a little more prone to clique fan bias I feel.

OK I'll shut up for now :)

[absolutedestiny.livejournal.com]

ack P.S. I noticed you quoted "The basic principles of matching audio and visuals are pretty simple... it's just that lots of people don't pay enough attention to their audio. Once you actually start really listening to the song it all falls into place."

I wrote that :) It made me very happy to see that referred to :D

I could do with expanding that page a little as it happens.

[permetaform]

::GAPES:: okay, adding you NOW. you don't have to add me back as I tend to ramble about everything and sundry and rec tons of slashy/yaoi fics randomly, but I've added you to my 'vids' filter if you're curious. =)

[permetaform]

The differences are facinating, not only the differences between the techniques in the two forms but also the fandom and appreciation.

heh, we have our own problems too; there's more likely to find groups of FArt vidders; ie. FunArt vidders who 'vid for fun only' and refuses to accept anything that resembles critique. And YET they demand critique-level praise.

See, I'm fine with vidders who vid just for fun, but don't expect me to give them oodles of praise that I don't think they deserve.

(and actually, that's the history behind the 'Elitist Bitch' icons you may see floating around; the VVC group tried to start up critical discussion and they got flamed and labeled as Pretentious Elitist Bitches. They turned around and used it as a rallying cry. This icon I'm using right now is also a derivative of the same kerfuffle)

[permetaform]

ooo, forgot to say that I'm going to take a peek at the interviews and the top favorites in a bit! =)